Starting Issues - Still!

[YellaBelly]

After my previous thread about non-starting when hot, I think that the timing may not have been the total issue. I adjusted the timing as best I could get to 8deg before TDC and took the car out again. After a few minutes of being stopped, it would not start again (ask Lucky Ed).

I tweeked the dizzy again a little until I could get the car to start, and when I got home tried again but still no-go!

I also noticed on the way home that from the voltmeter that the alternator didn't seem to be charging, but after about 5 mins it was showing charge again??

I am starting to think that the electrics are to blame now. I have checked earths, connections etc. but all seems OK. I do think though that the alternator may not be pushing out quite as much as it should.

Does anyone know if the standard Sierra type alternator can be serviced at home?

I have put the battery on a re-cycling charger overnight and will see what happens tommorrow after a good run.

JB

[Lucky Ed]

Sounded more of an electrical problem to me, with the lack of cranking power.

If he battery is new and earths are ok - do you know the history of the starter motor?

Great to see you out and about - good luck problem solving

[nickt241]

it may sound obvious,but check your battery terminals,if theyve used the original ford one then it probrably has multiple connections that are attached individually,depending how theyve wired the car,if one or more are loose it would explain your problems with alternator and charging......if not,then check the rear of the starter solenoid and see if it has two small and one large wire connections,it should have one of each,but some have two and the spare one feeds power to the ignition,it normally has a round as opposed to spade connection,again,if this is loose or has a bad connection then it will explain both your problems...lastly,check the connections on the rear of the alternator as that could also cause both your problems........a quick test to see if its a problem on any of these connections is to find the main charging wire on the rear of the alternator,and run a temporary wire between this and the battery positive,make sure you connect it and still leave the original plug connected to the alternator,if you do this then the charge should feed back through to your ignition,in which case both your charging and starting problem should be cured...its only a temporary solution to prove a point,but as this wire will not be switched then its not permanent.

another thing that has just occurred to me is to double check your engine earths,unlikely to be the problem as your starter still works,but it has been known,and more so on fibreglass cars!

[YellaBelly]

Thanks for the input mate, but I built the car from scratch, including the loom and made sure all the cables/connections were up to the job. I had a similar problem before but that was with an old battery so I assumed that was the fault. I fitted the new battery but even then it wasn't spinning over very fast. So I checked all earths and connections, and also stripped and cleaned the starter commutator and checked the brushes. After that it seemed much better.

So as the fault is very similar, except that I notice it more when it's hot. But come to think of it, when I had the issue before, the car didn't have a run so never really got hot.

Anyhow, I am off to get a new starter motor tommorrow and hope to god it cures the problem

[YellaBelly]

Collected my reconditioned starter motor this afternoon, fitted and tested and so far it seems to have sorted the problem. Spins up nice and quick compared to the old one. I tested it when warm, then let it run for a while at 3000rpm to get hot and all seemed fine. Left it for 10 minutes and tried again and still OK. The real test is going to be after a 15-20 min run, but that is out of the question at the moment due to the British Summer!  But I am optimistic

[Lucky Ed]

Pleased to hear you think you've solved the problem.

You better keep away from me in the future as my bad luck seems to have infected your car now

[evolution]

Collected my reconditioned starter motor this afternoon, fitted and tested and so far it seems to have sorted the problem. Spins up nice and quick compared to the old one. I tested it when warm, then let it run for a while at 3000rpm to get hot and all seemed fine. Left it for 10 minutes and tried again and still OK. The real test is going to be after a 15-20 min run, but that is out of the question at the moment due to the British Summer!  But I am optimistic

Did you manage to get her out? Hope it's sorted your problem.
Steve

[YellaBelly]

Not yet mate, hoping or a break in the weather this morning sometime just so I can go for a run as a final check. Got a full day but I'm sure I can manage one in if it stays dry for long enough

I'm just waiting on some rubber seals for the windscreen and hopefully I can get that fitted soon, and once that's on I can set to sorting out making a soft roof and sidescreens. I have a couple of sidescreens already but not sure if they are going to fit without a lot of fettling.

Anyhow, here's hoping for a good break in the weather

JB

[evolution]

I think now will be your best bet, rain pm clear again this evening

[evolution]

WELL?

[YellaBelly]

WELL?

What do you think?

Went for a 30 mile blat yesterday, stopped to top up the fuel, and she started fine. Spins up like a good 'un!

I have done some tweaking of the tie-bars to try and centralise the steering wheel, (awkward because it's the ford 6-sided column not the spliined one), but I need to re-check the tracking and the ride height/damping will still need adjustment, but at least I can drive it now

Still not 100% about the alternator though. When I first start it from cold, the charging light is still on until I blip the throttle, then it goes out. The voltmeter backs it up too showing no charge until I do that. Once it's running it's fine all the time. Almost lik it needs a kick-start to get it charging?

Don't know whether the diode pack would cause that or maybe brushes?

JB

[evolution]

Obviously very glad it's sorted and you can now start to enjoy her with one less anxiety.  Re your charging it may be that the kick from your battery needed to start the engine is initially taking all the alternator gives.  You may, or may not, be aware that my warning light lightly glowed permanently and, although that's sorted, lead me to fit a voltmeter. After firing her up volts 12.2-12.5, short drive (3-400 metres) and it goes up to 13.2-13.7. As long as this is the case and my warning light remains off then I won't be concerned.
Steve

[YellaBelly]

OK, thanks chap. I'm not unduly worried like I say because the voltmeter sits just under 14V all the time I'm running after the initial kick so that is a better indicator. It does drop when I put the main lights on but I forgot to note exactly what it dropped to. I'll check next time I'm out.

JB

[evolution]

Sitting just under 14 suggests yours is ok. Not sure what your output should be. Output for mine should be 13.4-13.7 and she is in need of belt replacement which is coolant drain and lots of pfaffing about which I'll leave til later in the year.  Should really have done it when I changed the radiator 
Steve

[YellaBelly]

Just checked the charging figures, and got the following:

Ign off--12.79V
Ign on--12.71V
Engine running on tickover (950rpm)--12.49V

(Blipping throttle takes voltage up to 14+V and ignition light goes out - after that it stays out)

2000rpm---14.05V
2000rpm (lights on) --- 13.87V
3500rpm (lights on) --- 13.87V

So I think alternator is fine (apart from the initial kick start issue).

['The Gaffer']

Sounds good matey.

Check wiring / connections on the lamp circuit as the alternator usually needs a good feed from this to energise the alternator into charging.

Also, have you fitted a larger than normal pulley as this can make the alternator spin slower and thus not energising at low rpm.

[YellaBelly]

Nope, standard pulley Phil. I'll check what connections I can get at without faffing behind the dash but I think I'll live with it until I fit the wipers then I will be taking the dash out anyhow so I can check the remaining connections then. It's fine if it goes over 1500rpm and then back to idle so no big deal, just an annoyance really.

JB

[evolution]

Figures pretty much as I would have expected. 12.49 at tickover from battery rather than alternator I think. No issues to report then 

[YellaBelly]

Yep, panic over methinks

Finished everything for the windscreen now, just waiting for the rubber seals then I can fit it. I'll sort the wipres slow time.

Just need some decent damn weather now.

[evolution]

I think there is some sun forecast for November

[YellaBelly]

Steve, do you still have that alternator going spare? Took the missus out for a drive last night and we stopped at a pub about 25 miles away, when I started the car the belt was squeeling like anything and the charging light would not go out when I blipped the throttle. When I got the smell of burning rubber I thought it best to turn off the car!!

The alternator had seized and the belt was spinning around the pulley. I freed the alternator off with a screwdriver and it was then fine, lights on coming back and it was charging OK.

I took the alternator off today and the rear bearings sound shot so I'm guessing it's had enough?

If you still have it, I assume it is the same fit as the standard Sierra one?

Thanks mate.

John

[evolution]

John,
I've pm you my number.
Steve