best place to source donor bike engine?

[bluehornetrider]

I'm looking to build a MNR Vortx R1, I'm pricing up possible donor parts.
Where is the best place to look for bike engines, is it better to get a complete bike and strip to sell off spare parts or buy just the engine.  What other bits will I need from the bike?
Is there a good place to buy a diff or is it best to source from the kit supplier?

Any advice woud be much appreciated, Cheers Guys

['The Gaffer']

Most bike breakers will have engines, just look for reputable ones and if local ask to hear the engine on the bike before its dismantled. Other way is to buy a crashed bike and take out engine, if rest of bike isnt too badly damaged you can sell parts to offset the cost. Damaged bike must be cheap though and more hassle in selling parts. eBay is a good place to start looking for engines as well as diffs.

[bluehornetrider]

If and when I come to have the kit registered how will it be taxed for the road, bikes are about £50 but putting a 1000cc engine into a car must adjust the cost.

[Hairy Santa]

£125 per year

[TimC]

I've recently bought my third bike engine for a project.  Each of mine has been found either on web-classifieds or on eBay.

You can go to the likes of Yorkshire Engines or AB Performance for a package, which in theory should be good - each of these certainly has a name to protect.  However, you will pay through the nose for the privilage.  I was quoted £1700 for a 4C8 R1 from Malc at Yorkshire Engines.  Instead, I found one on eBay with low miles, service history etc that was still in the damaged frame.  I heard it running and picked it up for less than £850 with all anciliaries.  I even got the clocks - although they are smashed, they may still give me fault codes.

What model R1 are you looking for?  I build a MNR R1 a long time ago. See http://www.farcester.com/2007/02/and-so-we-begin.html

TC

[bluehornetrider]

Thanks HairySanta that info's very helpful.  TimC I'm looking for the same model as you built but for the road.  I'm after an injected R1, blade or GSXR1000.  Is it possible to use the bike gearbox with a quickshifter or do you have to use a car gearbox?

What parts do you have to source yourself?  can you get all you need from MNR?
Cheers Paul.

[dikkie]

not exactly what you want but it's local:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/cbr1000rr-engine-kit-car-project-/180800101511?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item2a18869c87#ht_500wt_950

[TimC]

Thanks HairySanta that info's very helpful.  TimC I'm looking for the same model as you built but for the road.  I'm after an injected R1, blade or GSXR1000.  Is it possible to use the bike gearbox with a quickshifter or do you have to use a car gearbox?

What parts do you have to source yourself?  can you get all you need from MNR?
Cheers Paul.

Paul, 
Much to answer there - will try to give you a comprehensive answer over the weekend.

Tim

[TimC]

Regarding gearbox you use the standard bike unit, potentially with an uprated clutch.  I'm not sure what you mean by quickshift.  Gear change will be either by a stick - push up to go down the box and pull back to change up (or vice-versa; neutral is between 1st and second) - or a paddle shift operating in the same way, or via an electronic button or paddle system (I wouldn't go that route again!)  To pass the IVA test as part of the process to make it road legal, you will need a working reverse.  Bike engines, Honda Goldwing etc aside, do not have a reverse gear.  Instead you need to use either a reverse transfer box which sits between the output shaft of the gearbox and the diff or alternatively an electric arrangement using a starter motor acting upon a ring gear.

MNR would be able to supply everything you need, albeit at a cost.  They tend to use fabricated front uprights now so the only things that you could sensibly source would be a Sierra rear axle and your engine package.  Virtually everything else would probably want to be new.  Have you costed the build at all?  Think five-figures as a start-point.  Do not get the exhaust from MNR.  In my opinion you are better off going to specialist like Powerspeed in Cardiff.

[bluehornetrider]

Cheers for that link dikkie, if I was to get an engine like that from ebay how would I go about getting a V5 as I want to use it on the road?

Is there a newer alternative to a Sierra rear axle?  Maybe a bit lighter.
TimC what problems did you have with the  electronic button or paddle system ? as you said that you wouldn't use it again.

In my bike riding days quite a few superbike riders used quickshifters which cut the ignition as pressure was applied to the gearchange so you didn't need to use the clutch on gearchanges.

Which is the better option a Quiafe reverse box or an electric reverse?  What are the pros and cons of each?

['The Gaffer']

TimC what problems did you have with the  electronic button or paddle system ? as you said that you wouldn't use it again.

Which is the better option a Quiafe reverse box or an electric reverse?  What are the pros and cons of each?

I had quickshifter and trickshifter on my blade kit for clutchless up and down shifts with auto blip on downshifts. Great fun and never gave me any bother. A little clunky around town but at speed it was very easy to use. Some might say that the manual change is less prone to problems.

Quiafe but 1000 times more expensive than an electric reverse. Quiafe easier to fit and much more reliable and easy to use. Quiafe does not sound like a milk float.

[TimC]

Some of the auto-blipping / ignition cut kit is very good, but I would avoid automating the shift action itself - very difficult to find neutral and can increase wear on selector forks.

As for the reverse, I'll disagree with The Gaffer's post.  The Quaife unit tends to spit its oil out and it does zap a few BHP.  The MNR unit solves the oil issue but both are prone to vibration at track speeds.  A well engineered electric reverse unit should weigh less, be reliable, not zap any BHP and be cheaper.  I can't help the milk float sound I'm afraid.

Rear axle options as far as I am aware vis-a-vis MNR are Freelander (light, expensive to fit with LSD and best suited to a ZX-10R) or MX-5 (ratios not suited to bike-installation as far as I'm aware)  The Freelander option will also need custom halfshafts so more expense.  For an R1 you'll need a 3.38 Sierra CWP which sadly don't come cheap either.  You could investigate a Suburu diff - see if they will fit one - some are a 3.54 ratio which will work with the R1 and many come with a viscous LSD.  Again, you'll need custom driveshafts though.